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Turbo TR6? Yes sir!

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Rex A Lott Avatar
Rex A Lott Steve Kincaid
Newcastle, Washington, USA   USA
1976 Triumph TR6 "Trix"
I'm not experienced with turbo but I've been looking into them with interest in possibly outfitting my TR6. Here are some thoughts I had while reading this topic. Any comments are appreciated.

  • If you can make 180 bhp with one ZS carb, that seems to dismiss all the folks who performed a triple ZS carb upgrade
  • If the carb is upstream of the turbo, then don't you blow fuel out the wastegate? Aren't you afraid of bursting into flames when you lift the gas pedal?
  • Did you make major adjustments to the ZS carb? New needle? Is it basically adjusted the same way it was before turbo?
  • How did you come to determine timing adjustments? Did you follow instructions, a formula, or performance testing?

Thanks for posting! This is exciting.

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rjtr6 Avatar
rjtr6 Richard Janvier
Quebec, Quebec, Canada   CAN
Hello Steve

I don't know how many HP I have from one ZS, surely not 180 hp. Remember this is a forced induction on a non-ported head.
At the best I have HP figure around what you get by conventionnal performance modification (increase CR, camshaft, carb, etc)
The fun part is that the torque arrives sooner and in my case much cheaper.

The wastegate is on the exhaust side of the turbo so no fuel there.

I changed the needle for B1AR and yes the adjustment is the same as before. I checked the air/fuel ratio with a wideband oxygen sensor.

I did performance testing for the distributor advance. When I got detonation I back off the advance and limit the total to 16-20 degrees. It is not ideal but it works for now. Next summer I will install a spark control from MSD and increase the advance a little more.

Hope this help

sixtynine Avatar
sixtynine mitch somethingorother
las vegas, nv, USA   USA
Looking at Richards photo. And if you're familiar with Su Hd8's smiling smiley
Would i need the front or rear SU or would it make a difference.

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Rex A Lott Avatar
Rex A Lott Steve Kincaid
Newcastle, Washington, USA   USA
1976 Triumph TR6 "Trix"
Richard,
Thanks for your answers to my questions! Keep updating us.

poolboy Avatar
poolboy Ken D
Sandy Hook, Mississippi, USA   USA
In reply to # 941346 by sixtynine Looking at Richards photo. And if you're familiar with Su Hd8's smiling smiley
Would i need the front or rear SU or would it make a difference.

You'll have to consider where you want the float chamber and the throttle shaft lever.

sixtynine Avatar
sixtynine mitch somethingorother
las vegas, nv, USA   USA
Richards looks like a straight shot (linkage) with the stromberg. I'm not familiar with the su though.

In reply to # 941375 by poolboy
In reply to # 941346 by sixtynine Looking at Richards photo. And if you're familiar with Su Hd8's smiling smiley
Would i need the front or rear SU or would it make a difference.

You'll have to consider where you want the float chamber and the throttle shaft lever.

triumph13 Avatar
triumph13 Stewart B
Williamstown, Ontario, Canada   CAN
Hi Richard,
Been following your progress from the beginning and now it's time for me to start on my own Turbo6 project. Would love to be able to see what you have done in person. Were about in Quebec are you located. I'm about an hour from Mtl.
Can you post or pm me when you get a chance.
Thanks. Stewart.

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dicta dick Taylor
Downey, Callifornia, USA   USA
In reply to # 941346 by sixtynine Looking at Richards photo. And if you're familiar with Su Hd8's smiling smiley
Would i need the front or rear SU or would it make a difference.

sixtynine --- It depends on how the whole thing is packaged. Here's one example…

Dick


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100_1078.JPG

Thunderinjp Avatar
Thunderinjp John Inch
Glace Bay, Nova Scotia, Canada   CAN
1973 Triumph TR6 "Little Red"
That looks like a sweet set-up . . . .

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rjtr6 Avatar
rjtr6 Richard Janvier
Quebec, Quebec, Canada   CAN
UPDATE (finally)

Hello everybody!
My TR6 turbo set up is still going strong. After few tweaking, the car is more pleasant to drive. I still use the CD175 Stromberg that I have modified to better suit the fuel demand. I've tried different retard figure of the ignition to avoid detonation and of course I use premium fuel only. I don't know how hp this engine make and I don't mind. It is going stronger than the tuned PI TR6 that I drove earlier this spring. Good enough for me.
This summer, I've replaced every single bushing with Prothane, intalled a quick ratio steering rack with solid mounts and replaced the suspension with an uprated one on four corners. I kept the Armstrong lever shocks on the rear with a stiffer valve spring. Everything works fine. I also installed 16 inch wheels with 205 wide tires. Now, it's like driving a little gokart. The next step will be adding a limited slip differential and a J-type overdrive.

Best to all
Richard


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TR6-2.jpg

poolboy Avatar
poolboy Ken D
Sandy Hook, Mississippi, USA   USA
Welcome Back, Richard !
Sounds like a fun ride.

dicta dick Taylor
Downey, Callifornia, USA   USA
In reply to # 1490963 by rjtr6 UPDATE (finally)

Hello everybody!
My TR6 turbo set up is still going strong. After few tweaking, the car is more pleasant to drive. I still use the CD175 Stromberg that I have modified to better suit the fuel demand. I've tried different retard figure of the ignition to avoid detonation and of course I use premium fuel only. I don't know how hp this engine make and I don't mind. It is going stronger than the tuned PI TR6 that I drove earlier this spring. Good enough for me.
This summer, I've replaced every single bushing with Prothane, intalled a quick ratio steering rack with solid mounts and replaced the suspension with an uprated one on four corners. I kept the Armstrong lever shocks on the rear with a stiffer valve spring. Everything works fine. I also installed 16 inch wheels with 205 wide tires. Now, it's like driving a little gokart. The next step will be adding a limited slip differential and a J-type overdrive.

Best to all
Richard

Richard --- Earlier you said you were going to up the boost to 10 lb. Have you done this yet? How about the MSD6-BTM install? Water injection? I ask this because I found these necessary to safely get up to (and beyond) the 10 lb. you were seeking.
Isn't this fun?!

Dick

Tote Tony M
Kingston, Ontario, Canada   CAN
Tres Bien Richard!
Your TR6 looks really cool with the paint and wheels and now a turbo! You have a real eye for design. I used to ride motorcycles (many) in my younger days and I've said that driving the TR6 is as close to riding a motorcycle but on four wheels as one can get. A real go-kart it is. That's why I have kept mine all these years.

Salut! Tony

rjtr6 Avatar
rjtr6 Richard Janvier
Quebec, Quebec, Canada   CAN
Richard --- Earlier you said you were going to up the boost to 10 lb. Have you done this yet? How about the MSD6-BTM install? Water injection? I ask this because I found these necessary to safely get up to (and beyond) the 10 lb. you were seeking.
Isn't this fun?!

Dick

Tres Bien Richard!
Your TR6 looks really cool with the paint and wheels and now a turbo! You have a real eye for design. I used to ride motorcycles (many) in my younger days and I've said that driving the TR6 is as close to riding a motorcycle but on four wheels as one can get. A real go-kart it is. That's why I have kept mine all these years.

Salut! Tony



Hello Dick
No I didn't reach the 10psi mark yet. I'm at 9psi actually. I'm afraid to break something in the driveline.
I didn't install MSD or water injection. I've done many road tests and no detonation occured. Maybe later.
Yes, it is fun, very much!
Thank you
Richard

Salut Tony
Merci pour les commentaires (thank you for the comments) It's a real pleasure to drive this car.
My best friend ride a 1989 Miata and he is impressed by the turbo hissing when I follow him in the bumper :-)
Best
Richard

TR-Fuzzy Jörg Kratz
BC, BW, Germany   DEU
Hello all together,

my name is Joerg. I`m from Germany and I`m working on Triumphs for the last 23 years.
My TR6 is an original European LHD PI model. Unfortunately it is currently fitted with a US-carb-engine.
A blueprinted and hopefully powerful PI-engine with the original injection is in work.

But I want to build a second 6-cylinder engine with a turbo charger.
Here in Germany this setup isn`t very common. But if we look on Dicks TR6, I think from historical perspective, it is absolutely correct and I like the idea behind it. >>> simple and powerful.

@Richard.
I followed the thread from the beginning and it is cool that there is an update and that your engine is still in a good running and powerful shape.
Your project is exactly that, what I hoped and I expected from this setup. >>> Simply and great !!!!

It is very interesting for me to read, that you are able to run your TR6 without a lot of complex stuff.
I`m sure, if you would install a programmable ignition and water injection, you could find a couple of hidden hp.

@Dick do you have (or anyone else has) information about the introduction date of the Arkay-kit?
This information could be helpful for the historical registration here in Germany. Or should I contact Kas Kastner and ask him?
It would be also very helpful if I could find any further information about the Arkay-kit. For example copies of brochures or any other advertising stuff from the 70s or 80s.

I know hp figures are good for writing on a piece of paper, the real life is different. But nevertheless in the end it is interesting.
What is the possible output?
>>>6 PSI / 165hp and 12 PSI / 200hp
Is this an estimation or are these measured figures?
Are we talking about engine or wheel horse powers?
Which components and modifications do you use for these figures?
CR 7,? : 1, head?, cam?, exhaust manifold before and behind the charger (single or double)?, modifies intake manifold?

Here are my ideas and collected components:
So my 250, which is a typical US-TR, is a good and light weight basic. Target is to get under 900kg.
I`m planning this for several years. To get information, I was in contact with Kas Kastner and Dick Taylor (do you remember?) a couple of years ago.
The plan is to copy the original Arkay-kit (>>>Kas Kastner >>>Dick Taylor). A little modified and with more modern components. The TR250 is a full restoration project and there is no need to harry up. So I have enough time to collect parts and information. I have some books for old school turbo conversions and I read as much as possible.

The first idea was to build a 2l engine. But I like the low end torque of the 2,5l, which could help to cover the turbo lag. So I hope to get early a high torque figure, a flat curve and around 200hp. May be 200whp.

Engine:
Crankshaft: grinded, nitride, balanced
Forged pistons
H-shaft rods
Block with camshaft bearings
Camshaft: Newman 260 >>>mild and higher lift.
Aluminum roller rockers
Head: late, flowed valves and ports and with pistons a CR of 7,4:1
Carb: SU HS8
Innovate AFR monitor
Turbo charger: IHI VF35 (Subaru Impreza WRX 2,0) with a 2,5” downpipe. It spools up very quickly and is in a Subaru 2,5l good for over 320hp.
Piping: DIY
Ignition: I want to keep the classic look. Original distributor which is programmable, mappable. >>>Aldon Amesyst or CB-Performance-Blackbox or ….?
Water methanol injection with a control unit (MF2 injection controller).
Drivetrain:
Gearbox: Triumph J-Overdrive modified with Volvo parts.
Clutch: Saab Turbo
Diff: LSD Jaguar XJ
Rear hubs: Cambridge motorsports

If my calculations are right (CR 7,4:1, boost 14 PSI) I will have a theoretical CR of 10,5:1 (under boost). And If the figures in the literature are right, a CR of 10,5:1 is the critical point for a TR6 combustion chamber. So the water methanol injection, high octane min. 98 fuel and a programmable ignition should make this boost level possible.

Because of the missing carbon seals in the IHI turbo, I have to install the throttle behind the charger. Or alternatively I have to install two synchronous throttles. One in the carb and one after the charger.
Or I find a modern charger which spools up quickly and is equipped with the carbon seals.
I´m open for suggestions which type would work and where I could get it.

Please don`t hesitate to give me tips or feedback.


Best regards
Joerg



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-10-11 02:31 PM by TR-Fuzzy.

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