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4bbl intake manifold for tr6?

Posted by Rockstarnoguitar 
Danny J
Southern Pines, North carolina, USA   usa
1976 Triumph TR6 "Mother F*#%~r"

So I've heard legends of offenhauser making an aftermarket 4barrel intake manifold for the triumph tr6.... Or at least the guy thinks it was an offenhauser, but needless to say does this manifold or any like this exist? I hate my stroms, and want my car to be fuel reliable
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TR6Ken Avatar
Ken U
Loomis, CA, USA   usa

There is always the SU conversion. Carbs don't get much more simple than the SU.
Danny J
Southern Pines, North carolina, USA   usa
1976 Triumph TR6 "Mother F*#%~r"

Well I was gonna do the weber dual 2barrels but that didn't work out as the kit had been discontinued, found a Datsun 280z intake Manu for a 4bbl which I thought was neat since they always had su I'd thought but that intake won't fit so, therefore I'm trying to find the legendary 4bbl intake for the tr6... Plus I love hollys, they always work and a rebuild doesn't take an aero space engineering degree, and it just looks cool
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Kyle Darby
SW Washington, USA   usa
1965 Triumph TR4 "My Baby"
1966 Triumph 2000 MkI "Bessie"
1970 Triumph GT6+ (MkII) "The Princess"

Sometimes, the strombergs just need a professional touch... I gave my GT6 strombergs to a friend to rebuild. I told him the works, I want them right versus cheap. That was in late 2002 early 2003, and they are still doing great. I think he replaced the shafts and bushed them, butterflies and then a the rebuild kit as well. I dont mess with them as the car still runs very well. The down draft weber kits are out there, but you might have to dig. I would love to see pictures of the 4 barrel TR6 intake, but I have never heard of one. Kyle.
poolboy Avatar
Ken D
Sandy Hook, Mississippi, USA   usa

Stombergs were good enuogh for Jaguar, Volvo, Sunbeam, Saab, LandRover, Alfa Romeo, Aston Martin DBS, Lotus and others.
DannyJ is just another guy who hates them because he doesn't know how to either rebuild them, have them rebuilt or adjust them.
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Danny J
Southern Pines, North carolina, USA   usa
1976 Triumph TR6 "Mother F*#%~r"

Yes you are correct aside from the fact that only 3 of 4 of tw companies mentioned are known for solid reliability and fun out of an older English car and believe me I've been working in euro cars long enough to know what the good ones are... but I've been spoiled my whole life with older BMW and mid 80's vw's and reliable old fords, so with that said I will not argue with the fact that I don't know how to properly adjust them, I don't have time for that or I would have bought the weber kit, the mikunis are a really happy idea till I find a custom builder for the intake. And I did really enjoy my tr for the short time I drive it, best handling car I've had, just felt like it was on rails... But I'll just have to keep looking for what I want since my fiancé tells me I'm not allowed to sell it so that's pretty cool.... Cuz I also plan to turbo it because I have many turbos sitting in my shop and its different, not many turbo setups out there from what ive seen
Joseph O
Kaneohe, Hawaii, USA   usa

I was looking at possibly getting a Mikuni setup from V-Performance once. I don't know how unfriendly this site's staff is towards hyperlinks, so just type V-Performance in search. I currently have a Goodparts triple Stromberg setup on my car. It's a good manifold, it has the vacuum tube for the brakes and all, and after installing it I noticed better brake performance because of the bigger vacuum tube. I've talked to V-Performance and it sounds like they will do some machine work to customer specs to fit their Mikuni kit on whatever manifold the customer has. They specialize in Volvo P-1800's but they do stuff for other cars too. I talked to the proprietor on the phone, and he said he could machine adapters to make Mikuni's fit on my Stromberg manifold. The price looked like it was a little north of a grand for the triple set, but you'd have to talk to him yourself to know for sure. I didn't spring for buying them because I couldn't find any web reviews from TR-6 owners praising them, and I found some people on the internet (who may or may not have known what they were talking about) say they were only good at higher RPM's, like a sport bike.

Sorry if that's not info you were looking for, I just saw you mentioned Mikunis as a solution. I've never heard of a 4-barrel manifold, but I haven't been into owning a TR for too long now. The first time I tried to tune a carb was a few months ago and it was a triple Stromberg setup on my TR. I don't know a lot of Brit car guys in my area, just some muscle car enthusiasts. They all knew about Holleys and Edelbrocks, but they were dumbfounded as soon as I showed them the Strombergs and that floating cylinder thing they have. I'm still trying to get the things tuned. This week I got a synchrometer in the mail, so hopefully I can use that to dial them in and get them all running smoothly. Other than that, I learned to put oil in the top of them and block off the bypass diaphragm with industrial grade duct tape.

Sorry for the long winded post, been partaking in the Scotch tonight.

Cheers,
Joe
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poolboy Avatar
Ken D
Sandy Hook, Mississippi, USA   usa

There's no advantage whatsoever of triple anything or a 4 barrel anything on a TR6 engine unless it has been modified with, raised compression AND a performance cam or the 150 HP early PI cam at the very least.
For you who look upon the ZS carb as a mysterym which is not that different from any other side draft carb, you might want this:
http://www.buckeyetriumphs.org/technical/Carbs/CarbsI/CarbsI.htm

This is the ZS carb set up I had prior to going back to a basically stock engine:



................Here's a Short Video....................
video: http://s233.photobucket.com/albums/ee300/poolboy_album/?action=view&current=TR6SpiritatStartup.mp4



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/01/2012 08:48AM by poolboy.
Danny J
Southern Pines, North carolina, USA   usa
1976 Triumph TR6 "Mother F*#%~r"

Thank you for the input, and yes I have headers and have recently bought a nice hot cam and will be having my engine guy do the head work to make the tr what it should've been stock, deleting the smog controls and throwing an LSD in.... Needless to say I am going to drive it n/a until I can configure a good turbo setup, but as for Tri setups you are correct there is no advantage other than the braking the previous post talked of, but man does it not look cool to see a Tri-pack on anything? At most it's boasting rights, but the militia are definitely a better high rpm carb, they used to be used in jap cars an then were redesigned for jap bikes so therefore they are great if I'm pushing 11,000 rpms or driving wide open like I enjoy doing.... But the 4bbl is still what I want, but I've got 8mikunis offa two old Kawasaki 1200cc motors so I'm wondering if an 8pack would fit, and if so do I really want to deal with the adjustment on that mess.... Needless to say I am just bench racing since its winter time and I need to get this thing rolling, and ideas are great, and advice is appreciated, I mean I had an 85 vw golf with cis-e fuel injection, talk about a pain in the ass and power limitations, took that off replaced with two 2bbl side draft webers and it ran great, til my turbo setup didn't stay together all that well. Toys.... What's the point if you don't play with em
And make them the way you feel they should've been made
poolboy Avatar
Ken D
Sandy Hook, Mississippi, USA   usa

I never noticed a difference in braking effort though. The servo gets it's vacuum from the manifold vacuum obviously. The diameter of the tube or vacuum port opening has no affect on the amount of vacuum passing thru it. Just hook up a Vacuum Gauge with a 1/4" tube and it will indicate the same Vacuum as the 1/2" servo tube.
A stock TR6 cam for the carb'd engines creates about 18 in-Hg manifold vacuum at sea level when in good tune compared to 13 in-Hg with my S2 cam and about 15 with the GP2 cam, which seems to be an increasingly common modification


My engine as it is today, basically stock except for compression, flywheel and electric fan.
I hardly ever floor it, especially not going around curves and turns...occaionally though in 4th or 4 OD until I get to going fast enough.... 4000 rpms in 4 OD is pretty fast.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/01/2012 09:48AM by poolboy.
Danny J
Southern Pines, North carolina, USA   usa
1976 Triumph TR6 "Mother F*#%~r"

Y do you not floor it around curves? That was my favorite part of mine, but I've had the front pieces of the a-arms where they like to snap welded and bracketed for reinforcement, first thing I did to it cuz I'd heard nasty stories of them snapping and your front end hitting ground.... But I remember I was runnin 60 in a 45 and the light turned red.... So I took the almost 90degree turn at the intersection without slowing downshifted and stomped it, freak ins smoked like crazy but it took the exact straight path I'd wanted it to, had that been my bimmer Ida been doin a 180 into a ditch, and the golf woulda snapped my wrists from a turn that's hard, no p steering... But man the tr is just a sexy fun great car, I hate that mines been down so long...
poolboy Avatar
Ken D
Sandy Hook, Mississippi, USA   usa

I live in the country with lots of twisties and very little traffic; I don't floor it because I don't see the need to considering where the torque lies in the engine. Beside I'm really not into spin out's or rubber burning, anymore; I out grew that kind of stuff decades ago.. At 67 it doesn't take all craziness to get a rush.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/01/2012 01:37PM by poolboy.
Danny J
Southern Pines, North carolina, USA   usa
1976 Triumph TR6 "Mother F*#%~r"

Gotcha
tsnyder21 Avatar
Tom Snyder
lodi, ca, USA   usa

Some days knowing that I'm looking down at the grass rather than up is enough of a rush winking smiley
poolboy Avatar
Ken D
Sandy Hook, Mississippi, USA   usa

In reply to # 855215 by tsnyder21 Some days knowing that I'm looking down at the grass rather than up is enough of a rush winking smiley
Now that's a good one. Got to remember that one.
AJ6mod6 Avatar
Gareth T
Narva, Leningradskaya obl, Russian Federation   rus
1989 Jaguar XJ40 "Animal2"

Ever heard of the expression 4 into 6 doesn't go?

The very idea of using a 4 barrel carb on a 6 cylinder is a nonsense.

Btw the last photo of the dual stromberg manifold is a perfect example of what people believe is the case and what really works.

The dual manifold shown outflows ANY of the triple carb manifolds by a very long way, especially if it has been modified properly.
Just throw away the Strombergs and fit HS6 SUS like they did in the UK

I can guarantee you to get 175bhp from this set up.
poolboy Avatar
Ken D
Sandy Hook, Mississippi, USA   usa

hilarious..What ARE they putting in the water in Estonia these days ?
AJ6mod6 Avatar
Gareth T
Narva, Leningradskaya obl, Russian Federation   rus
1989 Jaguar XJ40 "Animal2"

What on earth are you talking about??

I have flow tested and modified these items.
Have you?
Have you ever used a superflow flow bench?

Do you have any idea what works or doesn't and what is the problem with the designs of these?

I have also written a book about this.
what has that got to do with Estonia?


This one is rubbish but looks good. It will NEVER work and has massive standoff issues.



This one looks rubbish but if you throw away the strombergs can work really well.
It's properly designed and is almost as good as fitting 3 webers.


Hudson, Wisconsin, USA   usa

Go to the Buckeye Triumph website as indicated in an earlier post to LEARN the proper way to rebuild the ZS carbs. The issue with these, as with any carb, is they do wear out and the seals go to hell. This isn't rocket science, just simple vacuum and venturi and gasoline on an internal combustion engine.

If you want real running problems then definitely get the Weber conversion. These carbs were meant for high rpm racing, not tooling around town and highway driving. Everyone, and I do mean everyone, that I have spoken with over the years have all complained that their Webers are a PITA to adjust properly (and they always go back to ZS or SU carbs to correct running issues). Wanting a 4bbl Holley/Carter/Edelbrock/Whatever carb is asking for even more problems. The SU and ZS carbs have a vacuum operated piston that is basically a infinitely variable venturi. Not much works better than a properly tuned carb of this type.

For real performance you'd want to look at multi-port fuel injection, computer controlled ignition, etc. With the proper cam, valves, intake and exhaust you might achieve 150hp like the original injected Euro engines had. But there is little in the way of finding a quick conversion of this type. Most people that have done this have adapted existing 6 cyl. engine systems to their cars. But these are neither simple nor cheap conversions, so stick to the KISS principle and appreciate reliability.

I won't even comment about the turbo idea. If you think you need forced induction on these overweight engines then look at Moss and throw down some big bucks for their supercharger package. At least they have the resources to develop and test the product.

If it's gobs of horsepower you're looking for, then why would you spend thousands on what is, realistically, a lousy engine? Just do a quick swap with any 4, 6 or 8 cyl that already has fuel injection, etc. The increase in hp and decrease in weight will have your car performing like the factory engineers could only have dreamed.
Danny J
Southern Pines, North carolina, USA   usa
1976 Triumph TR6 "Mother F*#%~r"

Thank you these are the answers I'm looking for, yet a still want a turbo. Not a supercharger fan.... I enjoy the whiplash from the boost kicking in, but I found a guy that can rebuild tune and flow test mine for $250, guarantees no problems and ill be happy. If after that and the engine buildup to get roughly 209hp I should be plenty happy, If not I will swap and m30 BMW 6 into it I know that engine and can easily get 300hp and a turbo setup I've already designed and worked with on that, but that's later.... See how the 2.5 works out.... Thank you all for input and thank you to anyone offended for still giving valuable info
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